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Post by Paul on Oct 1, 2024 8:30:47 GMT
Seen a fair bit of Potter chat this morning. Better than Southgate but still a large dollop of ‘meh’. Not sure if you watched MNF last night but they were pushing him for answers before the game. Didn't give up much but could tell that there was definitely a conversation during the summer. |
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Post by viking22 on Oct 1, 2024 8:57:57 GMT
Inzaghi's English apparently isn't great. Then again Erik was fluent in English but the players clearly don't understand half of what he is trying to say. And he would be a very exciting and progressive choice with a great track record in Italy and young enough that he can grow and adapt as a manager and would presumably be OK working under the INEOS structure (Bild claim that Tuchel wasn't which is why talks stalled). And best of all unlike the incredibly underwhelming candidates such as Potter, Southgate, Frank etc. he's shown he can win trophies which was the main reason some of us on here were willing to stick with Erik in the summer.
INEOS screwed up in the summer giving Erik the new contract and the benefit of the doubt as all the injuries muddied the picture and the feeling without competent football people around him Erik was having to do too much. They recruited well in the summer and our injury problems have been no worse than other clubs but we are still languishing midtable with negative goal difference and got spanked by both Liverpool and Tottenham.
But the situation is a lot better than in the summer.
In the summer we were under pressure because we wanted to start planning for the new season and needed to know who our manager was.
Now we have Ruud as a more than viable temporary manager who can hold the fort as long as we need. We can take our time to interview the immediately available managers and see if anyone stands out and if they do then we can appoint them before the year end and Ruud will return to the assistant manager role. And if no one is suitable then Ruud can continue until the end of the season and there will be a wider range of managerial candidates available in the summer. And hopefully we will make the right decision.
But we cannot have a situation where Erik keeps his jobs for weeks or months because INEOS are dithering around interviewing dozens of managers and unable to make up their mind.
The cat is out of the bag. The players already know that Erik is under review again and that undermines his authority and it is only a matter of time before they properly down tools and that will leave us even further adrift.
If he wins the next two games then fair play to him and he will get a little more time because that is how football works. But if he loses yet another game (and I have lost count of the number of games we've lost with Erik as manager but I am sure one of our resident statisticians could provide the information) then be decisive and sack him and appoint Ruud as temporary manager.
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Post by Rustin Cohle on Oct 1, 2024 9:38:19 GMT
Of the available options, I'd probably have Potter at the top. Well ahead of Southgate IMO. Chelsea were absolute peak mess when he went there and whilst his two replacements have done better, they also got to work on some stuff he built.
But he's not super inspiring. I'd certainly have preferred Poch.
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Post by Rustin Cohle on Oct 1, 2024 12:13:34 GMT
One thing I just saw - despite all the shit of the past decade, we have never missed out on Champions League qualification for two seasons in a row. We are in very serious danger of that this time, and it'd trigger some significant penalties in some sponsorships I believe.
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Post by seanie on Oct 1, 2024 13:25:19 GMT
Maresca is just benefiting from having years of having a transfer policy that was really throw enough shit at the wall and something will eventually stick. Palmer has been the transfer of the last few years anywhere for me and without him they wouldn't be even in that conversation. I think he is up there with a young Rooney. Chelsea are not that different to what they were in the last 10 or so games of the season last year, with Palmer kicking on and one or two other players adding goals in attack. Ten Hag in Ten Hag out it's the same old shit just repeating itself 2 years and back to reset. The latest theme the club has identified is revising the myth of youth players from the academy and transfer policy based on age! Fair enough, but if that's the plan you are going to have to wait a while to get the benefit Also what actual improvement in key areas was made to a poor team from last year apart from defense! Casemiro and Eriksen were deemed to old, but still here a year on. Eriksen can still play a bit in certain games. Barnsley and Southampton, but we are still reliant on him, which doesn't bode well for the youth. We sold McTominay and let go Amrabat and bought Ugarte and everyone knew he was primarily a ball winner and that's it in midfield, no net improvement really and certainly none as of yet, because he needs game time. We had the worst goal for in the top 10 last year and all we did was buy a talented youngster, who is primarily a link player with an average of about 6 goals a season at this level in Italy. So far the sum of our great Ineos window has been Mazraoui and de Ligt late to the team and Zirkzee, with a little bit of play for Ugarte! Dalot should be sharing game time with Mazraoui on the right, because he flatters to deceive and is worse as a left back and if he angles for a move to Madrid they should just let him fuck off there! We didn't buy a left back, because we have Luke Shaw  . If Dalot did that what he did on Sunday in a Fergie team he would be in a taxi and finished! We can't drop him because we don't have a left back at the club deemed good enough to play instead of him  If the Ineos plan is to build a team around youngsters for the future then great, but it's a gamble and will take time! |
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Post by seanie on Oct 1, 2024 13:26:27 GMT
One thing I just saw - despite all the shit of the past decade, we have never missed out on Champions League qualification for two seasons in a row. We are in very serious danger of that this time, and it'd trigger some significant penalties in some sponsorships I believe. We've only been in the top 4, 40% in 12 years since Fergie left. |
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Post by viking22 on Oct 1, 2024 13:46:57 GMT
Under Ten Hag we are a mid-table team. We cannot beat the big clubs. Liverpool and Tottenham both completely outplayed us. Our results are inconsistent against other midtable clubs and second tier European teams. And we can usually beat relegation fodder and lower league teams.
Even allowing for the deficiencies in our squad, injuries, youngsters needing time to reach their full potential etc. it is not good enough and previous managers did better with equally limited squads.
Attack does need more investment. But we have Bruno, Rashford, Garnacho, Amad, Hojlund, Zirzkee etc. It isn't as if he doesn't have options in attack and we should be scoring more than a goal a game.
Defence has been considerably strengthened. There aren't many centre back pairings out there better than Martinez and De Ligt even if both have been a little shaky in the start to the season. Onana has improved a lot and while he is still error prone he is no longer the problem he was last season. Mazraoui is looking good and Dalot was one of our better performers last season. And we've added Ugarte to beef up defensive midfield which should give our defence more protection.
But the main criticism is that Erik doesn't seem to have any kind of personality and seems unable to stamp his identity over the team so we can say this is an Erik Ten Hag team. Everything just looks a bit chaotic on the pitch and there isn't much evidence of good coaching on display. If players make mistakes or miss chances you can let the manager off for that (although he doesn't have to keep picking those same players!). But when we lack style and organization on the pitch that does reflect badly on the manager.
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Post by seanie on Oct 1, 2024 13:49:56 GMT
Under Ten Hag we are a mid-table team. We cannot beat the big clubs. Liverpool and Tottenham both completely outplayed us. Our results are inconsistent against other midtable clubs and second tier European teams. And we can usually beat relegation fodder and lower league teams. Even allowing for the deficiencies in our squad, injuries, youngsters needing time to reach their full potential etc. it is not good enough and previous managers did better with equally limited squads. Attack does need more investment. But we have Bruno, Rashford, Garnacho, Amad, Hojlund, Zirzkee etc. It isn't as if he doesn't have options in attack and we should be scoring more than a goal a game. Defence has been considerably strengthened. There aren't many centre back pairings out there better than Martinez and De Ligt even if both have been a little shaky in the start to the season. Onana has improved a lot and while he is still error prone he is no longer the problem he was last season. Mazraoui is looking good and Dalot was one of our better performers last season. And we've added Ugarte to beef up defensive midfield which should give our defence more protection. But the main criticism is that Erik doesn't seem to have any kind of personality and seems unable to stamp his identity over the team so we can say this is an Erik Ten Hag team. Everything just looks a bit chaotic on the pitch and there isn't much evidence of good coaching on display. If players make mistakes or miss chances you can let the manager off for that ( although he doesn't have to keep picking those same players!). But when we lack style and organization on the pitch that does reflect badly on the manager. Which players does he pick instead of the ones missing chances? |
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Post by unitedsotex on Oct 1, 2024 13:53:07 GMT
Dalot has progressively gotten worse at the LB position with each match. If Shaw and/or Malacia can't consistently be available, then we desperately need to replace them.
Maz and Dalot on the right will keep the competition high at RB but he is not a LB and it's exposing us.
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Post by viking22 on Oct 1, 2024 13:59:37 GMT
Everyone is missing chances to be fair. But the worse offenders are Bruno (by some distance) and then Zirzkee and Garnacho. Rashford is a better number 9 than Zirzkee. Hojlund should be reinstated as soon as possible as his goal conversion rate last season was as good as anyone's. And it might not be a bad idea to try Zirzkee in the hole behind Hojlund dropping Bruno until he can get his form back.
Might not be a bad idea to give Amass a go ahead of Dalot either.
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Post by Tatty on Oct 1, 2024 14:32:13 GMT
Baffled that we're not even thinking about a back 3 going forwards until one of Amass gets given a go, or Shaw/Malacia not being dead, happens. 5 in the middle, then 2 up top. At least try a different shape, as whatever we're doing now isn't doing anything either.
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Post by seanie on Oct 1, 2024 15:20:44 GMT
Baffled that we're not even thinking about a back 3 going forwards until one of Amass gets given a go, or Shaw/Malacia not being dead, happens. 5 in the middle, then 2 up top. At least try a different shape, as whatever we're doing now isn't doing anything either. Agree with that, but may have been more likely with Yoro fit. That's a classic Inzaghi set up BTW, but you need a first class finisher and second striker to really make that count at this level. Hojlund or Zirkzee can play the second striker and hold up, but not sure it would work with any combination of what we have. It's worth trying though |
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Post by kingkobbie on Oct 1, 2024 16:35:51 GMT
INEOS has fucked it up bigtime. I absolutely do not believe the nonsense that it takes years for a coach to establish himself in a new surrounding. There are enough examples out there currently to put this nonsense to bed Perfect example is Maresca. Came from the championship and has started to transfer what was a poor chelsea side last season in little to no time. Granted he has a hell of a squad to choose from, but he's established how he wants his team playing and got them playing it. Time to cut off the hand before we lose the entire arm. We're probably skating close to the line with PSR as it is having to sell to buy. Surely losing 17m is a hit worth taking when you stand to lose 5-10x that by having your season ended less than half way through it. This is not a defense of ETH, but Maresca has proven nothing and achieved nothing. Neither has Slot. ETH beat Arsenal and Liverpool in his first 6 matches and was looking pretty damn good after 6 months. These kind of short-term snippets mean nothing if it's not sustained. |
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Post by kingkobbie on Oct 1, 2024 16:38:16 GMT
Baffled that we're not even thinking about a back 3 going forwards until one of Amass gets given a go, or Shaw/Malacia not being dead, happens. 5 in the middle, then 2 up top. At least try a different shape, as whatever we're doing now isn't doing anything either. One of the biggest knocks against ETH. Try something else! |
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Post by DedRevil on Oct 1, 2024 16:41:41 GMT
Baffled that we're not even thinking about a back 3 going forwards until one of Amass gets given a go, or Shaw/Malacia not being dead, happens. 5 in the middle, then 2 up top. At least try a different shape, as whatever we're doing now isn't doing anything either. One of the biggest knocks against ETH. Try something else! Give us a defence of said knock... |
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. If Dalot did that what he did on Sunday in a Fergie team he would be in a taxi and finished! We can't drop him because we don't have a left back at the club deemed good enough to play instead of him 
