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Post by Stew on Nov 22, 2021 14:52:46 GMT
Poch has already won a French Cup, their charity shield (included in Tuchel’s quadruple by yourself) and has more or less won the league there by Christmas. He also took the super power that is Spurs to a Champions League final. There’s really not much in it. And regardless of whether or not we regard winning things in France as a significant, saying he doesn’t win things is simply false. He took Spurs to a European Cup final and bottled it. Against fucking Liverpool. That's unforgivable. My point about the trophies though is more that he was perfectly content not winning things - and keeping expectations there. This in spite of having the best Spurs side in decades that for all the world looked ready to take the step up. Blew the League in 2016, blew the European Cup in 2018. When Klopp lost the European Cup final, they went and won it the next season. When they didn't win the League, same thing. When Pochettino failed to get over the line Spurs went backwards. How did he ‘bottle’ the European Cup exactly? Liverpool are better than Spurs. They had a better team with better players. That’s ridiculous. They also went out and spent 160 million after they lost against Real, double what Spurs did after they lost the final.
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Post by Paul on Nov 22, 2021 15:02:07 GMT
There is an Italian option
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Post by Stew on Nov 22, 2021 15:02:47 GMT
People go on about Poch like he wasnt in charge of SPURS. SPURS!
They’re a punchline. You’d swear they were some sort of football super power instead of a joke. I keep hearing about ‘important trophy’s’ You know the last time Spurs won one of those?
1984. But yeah, Poch is a bottler. He totally held them back from becoming a trophy winning machine.
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Post by Bestie on Nov 22, 2021 15:10:26 GMT
I would prefer to wait and get it right. Be that ten Hag, Enrique, Mancini, or Rodgers. I take it then that you would prefer Rodgers over Pochettino... I am trying to find a significant difference... I am sure you have that thought in your head and I'd be happy to hear what you think... For me, ten Hag all day long with Rangnick as interim to then become DoF...never going to happen but that's my ideal scenario... The real differences for me come down to a couple of things. Rodgers overachieved for the squad but failed to meet expectations at Liverpool. Big club, regardless of current squad the demand is always for trophies. The job was probably too soon for him and I think ultimately failing was a good maturing experience for his career. Went to Celtic, same level of demand and probably higher expectations given the state of Scottish football. He totally dominated and played brilliant football. Leicester, has raised expectations and massively overachieved by winning trophies while developing players and playing good football again. Pochettino got the Spurs job on the back of a good season Southampton, where he seemed to do well with youth and played decent football but not necessarily my preferred style. At Spurs the expectation was that he would take them to the next step after a decent few seasons in and out of the top four. 3rd, 2nd, 3rd isn't a bad return on the first three seasons but that if any club was going to take advantage of the expected title challengers not being at it, Spurs should have been the one. Alright Leicester was a dream season but even then Spurs just kind of handed it to them in the end. I remember them losing a cup final to Chelsea after a fairly easy run to get there and getting turned over. Getting to the European Cup final was another overachievement but again, they wilted in the final. For me, Rodgers has gone to clubs and consistently overachieved while raising expectations. Pochettino has gone to clubs and overachieved without raising them. I get a real 'happy to settle' vibe from Poch that I don't from Rodgers. That's possibly unfair, I know, but I doubt it will change.
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Post by Bestie on Nov 22, 2021 15:14:23 GMT
People go on about Poch like he wasnt in charge of SPURS. SPURS! They’re a punchline. You’d swear they were some sort of football super power instead of a joke. I keep hearing about ‘important trophy’s’ You know the last time Spurs won one of those? 1984. But yeah, Poch is a bottler. He totally held them back from becoming a trophy winning machine. The Spurs team Poch took over was in the best place to win a major trophy since 1984 and failed to push on. And for a club allegedly looking to break that cycle of being a punchline, Pochettino was perfectly happy to dismiss winning things.
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Post by Paul on Nov 22, 2021 15:15:05 GMT
People go on about Poch like he wasnt in charge of SPURS. SPURS! They’re a punchline. You’d swear they were some sort of football super power instead of a joke. I keep hearing about ‘important trophy’s’ You know the last time Spurs won one of those? 1984. But yeah, Poch is a bottler. He totally held them back from becoming a trophy winning machine. The guy literally said that winning trophies doesn't help a club, it only builds ego's. Not exactly a great statement to make if you want a manager to win trophies Hes a good manager, I just don't think he's as good as people make him out to be.
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Post by seanie on Nov 22, 2021 15:16:51 GMT
It's funny I feel the same way about Rodgers, that you do about Pochettino. I mean what the fuck do I know, but the one flaw in your argument there is the much bigger sample Rodgers has. At the end of the day he also won nothing at Liverpool in 3 years and there were no CL finals or Cup finals. Poch has barely started at PSG They did well last year to win the FA cup, but our genius played a send fiddle team against them in the 1/4s. I just find it hard to write of Pochettino and big up Rodgers at the same time That Liverpool team Rodgers nearly won the League with was absolutely filled with dross though. They had no right to be in a title race never mind get within a couple of games and a Gerrard slip. I actually couldn't stand Rodgers a few years ago. I thought there was a lot of self promoting BS about him, but I do think he's a bit more confident and experienced now. I think he has a great eye for a player and at United that would be a big plus with our resources.
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Post by Bestie on Nov 22, 2021 15:20:17 GMT
He took Spurs to a European Cup final and bottled it. Against fucking Liverpool. That's unforgivable. My point about the trophies though is more that he was perfectly content not winning things - and keeping expectations there. This in spite of having the best Spurs side in decades that for all the world looked ready to take the step up. Blew the League in 2016-17, blew the European Cup in 2018-19. When Klopp lost the European Cup final, they went and won it the next season. When they didn't win the League, same thing. When Pochettino failed to get over the line Spurs went backwards. How come bottling against Liverpool is unforgivable, but managing them isn’t a problem for getting Rodgers - himself having bottled plenty in his time - in? Because bottling against them means they got to win something.
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Post by keanosdog16 on Nov 22, 2021 15:20:54 GMT
People go on about Poch like he wasnt in charge of SPURS. SPURS! They’re a punchline. You’d swear they were some sort of football super power instead of a joke. I keep hearing about ‘important trophy’s’ You know the last time Spurs won one of those? 1984. But yeah, Poch is a bottler. He totally held them back from becoming a trophy winning machine. The guy literally said that winning trophies doesn't help a club, it only builds ego's. Not exactly a great statement to make if you want a manager to win trophies Hes a good manager, I just don't think he's as good as people make him out to be. Was that not Ole who said that, never heard Poch say it but then again i didn't follow everything he's ever said
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Post by Paul on Nov 22, 2021 15:22:03 GMT
The guy literally said that winning trophies doesn't help a club, it only builds ego's. Not exactly a great statement to make if you want a manager to win trophies Hes a good manager, I just don't think he's as good as people make him out to be. Was that not Ole who said that, never heard Poch say it but then again i didn't follow everything he's ever said Was Poch who said it. I don't follow everything but when a manager comes out with something like that it tends to stand out and be remembered. Especially when you're linked with him.
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Post by seanie on Nov 22, 2021 15:26:07 GMT
It is interesting though, because that Spurs team barely beat that Ajax team in the Semis after Ajax beat Real and Juve.(managed by Ten Hag) I still think Poch getting Spurs all time record points in one season and getting to a CL final was outstanding. It was a pretty tight squad with a few very good players.
Maybe the shortlist of Rodgers, Poch and Ten Hag isn't that bad at all. It's probably 2 leagues above Ole whatever they do
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Post by caino on Nov 22, 2021 15:33:04 GMT
People go on about Poch like he wasnt in charge of SPURS. SPURS! They’re a punchline. You’d swear they were some sort of football super power instead of a joke. I keep hearing about ‘important trophy’s’ You know the last time Spurs won one of those? 1984. But yeah, Poch is a bottler. He totally held them back from becoming a trophy winning machine. T he Spurs team Poch took over was in the best place to win a major trophy since 1984 and failed to push on.And for a club allegedly looking to break that cycle of being a punchline, Pochettino was perfectly happy to dismiss winning things. Poch took over from Tim Sherwood and they were 14th in the league. then over the course of a couple of seasons had them in the CL final....
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Post by Bestie on Nov 22, 2021 15:49:57 GMT
T he Spurs team Poch took over was in the best place to win a major trophy since 1984 and failed to push on.And for a club allegedly looking to break that cycle of being a punchline, Pochettino was perfectly happy to dismiss winning things. Poch took over from Tim Sherwood and they were 14th in the league. then over the course of a couple of seasons had them in the CL final.... Poch took over in May 2014 when Spurs were sixth in the League.
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Post by Rustin Cohle on Nov 22, 2021 15:53:22 GMT
I think it’s quite telling that Liverpool fans aren’t remotely bothered about the prospect of us getting Rodgers. If they truly rated him, they’d be fuming at the prospect of him coming here.
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Post by kstandhand on Nov 22, 2021 16:04:35 GMT
I think it’s quite telling that Liverpool fans aren’t remotely bothered about the prospect of us getting Rodgers. If they truly rated him, they’d be fuming at the prospect of him coming here. They wouldn't rate anyone remotely linked to us & since he left they have also won another European Cup & the Premier League.
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