Euro 24

[dazjoe]

Jul 14, 2024 22:18:27 GMT SAF_Legend said:

Jul 14, 2024 21:27:13 GMT Stew said:

First thing England need to do is bin Pickford. His distribution is appalling and against top teams, if you keep giving them the ball they hurt you.

Agree. I don't understand how he has been England's no 1.

Because the alternatives are Ramsdale, Henderson or Pope.

[Paul]

Thank fuck we didn't go with Southgate.

[Paul]

The only positive to take from this is realising how much of a beast Mainoo will be for us next season.

[dazjoe]

Disapopointed England didn't win but Spain were the clear best team throughout the tournament.

Bellingham, Mainoo, Palmer, Foden, and Saka still so young and can continue to get better and better. Gordon had a great season too, Branthwaite coming through; just need a new number 9 to replace Kane. Toney and Watkins are decent and all but not top class. And a new 'keeper would be great. Pickford is average, he's exactly what he is, an Everton level 'keeper.

[johnboy14]

Jul 14, 2024 22:59:29 GMT dazjoe said:

Disapopointed England didn't win but Spain were the clear best team throughout the tournament.

Bellingham, Mainoo, Palmer, Foden, and Saka still so young and can continue to get better and better. Gordon had a great season too, Branthwaite coming through; just need a new number 9 to replace Kane. Toney and Watkins are decent and all but not top class. And a new 'keeper would be great. Pickford is average, he's exactly what he is, an Everton level 'keeper.

Said the same about Belgium and they've never got close after 2018. That was a great chance for England. They had real experience and a great mix of youth. Depends who's coming through but you I can't think of a better opportunity to win something than last night for England.

[Karma]

We weren’t the favourites , however Southgate’s tenure has to be considered generally.
Would those blowing smoke up his arse now afford the same leniency say to a foreign manager, ignore the terrible tactics and football or indeed excuse the missed opportunity again under his tutelage against Italy ?
He is risk averse, stubborn and allows his favouritism towards certain players cloud his judgement.
Thankfully the gods of timing saved us from the impending horrors.
Imagine the slack he would be afforded from the English media if it happened. 🤮

[redcase]

I hope Southgate is rewarded with a new 5 year contract.

[Paul]

Jul 15, 2024 6:41:23 GMT Karma said:

We weren’t the favourites , however Southgate’s tenure has to be considered generally.
Would those blowing smoke up his arse now afford the same leniency say to a foreign manager, ignore the terrible tactics and football or indeed excuse the missed opportunity again under his tutelage against Italy ?
He is risk averse, stubborn and allows his favouritism towards certain players cloud his judgement.
Thankfully the gods of timing saved us from the impending horrors.
Imagine the slack he would be afforded from the English media if it happened. 🤮

That's the thing. They were the favourites before and throughout the tournament. The media do it everytime. Overhype a team that really isn't anything special. Doesn't help with a manager like Southgate either.

On paper great individual players, as a team they're absolute dross with the odd moment of promise.

Just glad Shaw and Mainoo came through it unscathed. Couldn't care less about the rest.

[Kojak]

Jul 14, 2024 22:47:36 GMT dazjoe said:

Jul 14, 2024 22:18:27 GMT SAF_Legend said:

Agree. I don't understand how he has been England's no 1.

Because the alternatives are Ramsdale, Henderson or Pope.

Aye, he’s been told to kick it long last night to avoid the press. That was the tactics. He was being told by the attacking players to launch it into wide areas.

To be fair to Pickford, he’s never let England down. Ramsdale has made more mistakes than him for England and he’s barely played. The alternative options are woeful. Pope is one of the worst keepers in the league with the ball at his feet. If there’s a problem with the England team, it doesn’t currently lay with the goalkeeping position.

[Kojak]

Jul 15, 2024 6:04:33 GMT johnboy14 said:

Jul 14, 2024 22:59:29 GMT dazjoe said:

Disapopointed England didn't win but Spain were the clear best team throughout the tournament.

Bellingham, Mainoo, Palmer, Foden, and Saka still so young and can continue to get better and better. Gordon had a great season too, Branthwaite coming through; just need a new number 9 to replace Kane. Toney and Watkins are decent and all but not top class. And a new 'keeper would be great. Pickford is average, he's exactly what he is, an Everton level 'keeper.

Said the same about Belgium and they've never got close after 2018. That was a great chance for England. They had real experience and a great mix of youth. Depends who's coming through but you I can't think of a better opportunity to win something than last night for England.

I think the previous Euros was a better opportunity for England. That Italy side were rubbish. Didn’t even qualify for the World Cup. They were inferior on the night and on paper. England lost to the burden of pressure that night as much as anything else.

Really Spain have just been a better side as a collective. Some of the players might be inferior to England’s, but as a unit and an actual functioning team they’ve been considerably better. Especially in terms of balance. England were lopsided from the first game.

It was evident after probably 20mins last night that if England were going to win it, it would have to be won in moments. The equaliser was a moment, it wasn’t a build up of pressure. And at 1-1, for a winner to come it would have had to have been from a shot from the edge of the area, or a handball in the box.

Don’t think anyone should have any complaints today. England have lost to a better side.

[Stew]

Jul 15, 2024 8:16:52 GMT Kojak said:

Jul 14, 2024 22:47:36 GMT dazjoe said:

Because the alternatives are Ramsdale, Henderson or Pope.

Aye, he’s been told to kick it long last night to avoid the press. That was the tactics. He was being told by the attacking players to launch it into wide areas.

To be fair to Pickford, he’s never let England down. Ramsdale has made more mistakes than him for England and he’s barely played. The alternative options are woeful. Pope is one of the worst keepers in the league with the ball at his feet. If there’s a problem with the England team, it doesn’t currently lay with the goalkeeping position.

I disagree mate. Maybe Pickford was under instruction but his distribution was appalling last night. And if that was the tactic it was terrible and failed as expected. The last time that worked was Jose’s Inter against Barca in 2010. And that was a miracle.

I think I’d look at Pickford in a similar way to Rice- good player but nowhere near elite. Rice is willing but far too cumbersome to play holding mid against a side like Spain. He takes way too much out of the ball. Perhaps against say Slovenia or a mid Dutch side it’s ok but against Spain or Argentina you’ll be exposed. Whoever the next manager is, I’d be looking at that key position. You need a similar player to Kobe really. I’d also probably get Trent in at RB. He’s defensively suspect but so is Walker for England and Trent would at least create.

If I were an England fan I wouldn’t be too downbeat. Lots of talent coming through. But I’d certainly expect some changes to move onto the next level, ie winning things.

[Paul]

Amazed that Gordon had 2 minutes of football in the entire tournament aswell.

[viking22]

There is a lot of talent coming through. But you need a manager who can make the best use of it and Southgate has been holding England back. He didn't really seem to know what to do with Foden or Bellingham. Exciting players like Palmer and Gordon barely featured. Kane is too static and clearly wasn't fit this competition. And the whole team is shackled by Southgate's cautious style and preference to sit back and play it safe. And when the style of football is so appealing you need to win competitions. 

[Stew]

Pickford hit 25 long balls last night.

[Kojak]

Jul 15, 2024 8:38:37 GMT Stew said:

Jul 15, 2024 8:16:52 GMT Kojak said:

Aye, he’s been told to kick it long last night to avoid the press. That was the tactics. He was being told by the attacking players to launch it into wide areas.

To be fair to Pickford, he’s never let England down. Ramsdale has made more mistakes than him for England and he’s barely played. The alternative options are woeful. Pope is one of the worst keepers in the league with the ball at his feet. If there’s a problem with the England team, it doesn’t currently lay with the goalkeeping position.

I disagree mate. Maybe Pickford was under instruction but his distribution was appalling last night. And if that was the tactic it was terrible and failed as expected. The last time that worked was Jose’s Inter against Barca in 2010. And that was a miracle.

I think I’d look at Pickford in a similar way to Rice- good player but nowhere near elite. Rice is willing but far too cumbersome to play holding mid against a side like Spain. He takes way too much out of the ball. Perhaps against say Slovenia or a mid Dutch side it’s ok but against Spain or Argentina you’ll be exposed. Whoever the next manager is, I’d be looking at that key position. You need a similar player to Kobe really. I’d also probably get Trent in at RB. He’s defensively suspect but so is Walker for England and Trent would at least create.

If I were an England fan I wouldn’t be too downbeat. Lots of talent coming through. But I’d certainly expect some changes to move onto the next level, ie winning things.

It’s a funny thing to say this given the long balls and the stats you’ve mentioned in your next post, but he’s not that bad with his feet. Certainly compared to the other options. Some of his long passing throughout the tournament was quite good. Think the goal last night started with a quick throw. Pickford likes to play the ball short, Gareth brought him in originally as a keeper who is comfortable on the ball. I think last night must have been tactical to get through the press. Shit tactics and didn’t fucking work, clearly.

With you on Rice however. I think he’s improved Arsenal last season and maybe the way he plays is fine for them as they have a passing style implemented elsewhere in the team and they don’t face a press barring against top sides. He’s been barbaric in this tournament though. Was awful against the Dutch and got caught for their goal. Was really, really woeful last night. How anyone can claim Mainoo doesn’t progress the ball when that fucking oaf is stood next to him, I don’t know. I think Rice has attributes, but his ability on the ball isn’t one of them. Compared to Rodri who has the same attributes but can also dictate a game. That’s the sort of player England need to be trying to find. I’ve not seen much of the lad from Palace who never got a minute, but maybe he’s going to have that in his locker.