Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2015 23:12:47 GMT
The problem with cases like this is that it eventually turns men like Evans into the victim while the actual victim is ignored by both the press and social media. The subsequent events of this case raise questions over the administration of justice. Evans was committed, served his time and has been released. Under these circumstances he should be allowed to continue with his career as an important part of his rehabilitation. HOWEVER, like former teachers and lecturers under the same circumstances they find it almost impossible to continue their careers. Given the high profile of these kinds of cases surely if the principle of rehabilitation is to be adhered to, then convicts should be retrained for an alternative career and that should be part of the sentence - irrespective of appeals. Personally I don't want to see Evans grace any pitch, unless his appeal is successful. However, I also don't like the idea of imposing sentences without the prospect of rehabilitation, especially in cases of rape and the potential for repeat offenses. That's the thing though, he is allowed to continue his career. Nobodies stopped him from getting back in football. The FA, the Premier League, UEFA, FIFA. The only thing stopping him from being a footballer again is no club as of yet has been prepared to hire him. That's no different to any other job, be it plumber, banker, architect, postman, whatever. The law says you can go back to work, and he can. But that doesn't mean an employer has to give him work. If a plumber tried to get a job at a plumbing firm, and told the manager in the interview he'd just been released from prison after being convicted of rape, there's a very good chance he wouldn't be offered the job. Evans is in the same boat as most other jail birds. Nothing stopping you from getting employment apart from your own past. If the FA had come out and openly banned any club from offering him a contract, well, then that would be a whole different can of worms. |
|
_
United School Boy
100%
Posts: 0 
|
Post by _ on Jan 9, 2015 2:44:06 GMT
The problem with cases like this is that it eventually turns men like Evans into the victim while the actual victim is ignored by both the press and social media. The subsequent events of this case raise questions over the administration of justice. Evans was committed, served his time and has been released. Under these circumstances he should be allowed to continue with his career as an important part of his rehabilitation. HOWEVER, like former teachers and lecturers under the same circumstances they find it almost impossible to continue their careers. Given the high profile of these kinds of cases surely if the principle of rehabilitation is to be adhered to, then convicts should be retrained for an alternative career and that should be part of the sentence - irrespective of appeals. Personally I don't want to see Evans grace any pitch, unless his appeal is successful. However, I also don't like the idea of imposing sentences without the prospect of rehabilitation, especially in cases of rape and the potential for repeat offenses. That's the thing though, he is allowed to continue his career. Nobodies stopped him from getting back in football. The FA, the Premier League, UEFA, FIFA. The only thing stopping him from being a footballer again is no club as of yet has been prepared to hire him. That's no different to any other job, be it plumber, banker, architect, postman, whatever. The law says you can go back to work, and he can. But that doesn't mean an employer has to give him work. If a plumber tried to get a job at a plumbing firm, and told the manager in the interview he'd just been released from prison after being convicted of rape, there's a very good chance he wouldn't be offered the job. Evans is in the same boat as most other jail birds. Nothing stopping you from getting employment apart from your own past. If the FA had come out and openly banned any club from offering him a contract, well, then that would be a whole different can of worms. I agree with you but social media has interjected and is now dictating his future and that has a direct impact on the administration of justice as we used to understand it. If sponsors, clubs and a significant group of society can force an ex-con out of their former career there will be long term repercussions. Last thing anybody wants is this man being made a victim of persecution. |
|
|
|
Post by mightyez on Jan 9, 2015 7:41:01 GMT
its a very difficult one.
I say that because for me rape is very low, not to advertise or advocate prostitution but if you really want sex that badly pay for it. If your tired of your mrs or partner and want something different you can pay rather than rape, if you can't then pls pls do not stoop so low.
In evans case apparently the conviction was on the basis she was so drunk and out of it she couldn't possibly know what was happening, evans sees that as his defense in that it wasn't forceful like is most classic rape cases.
Whatever the case may be the law is the law and the law states that what he did is classed as rape.
evans really if he was more contrite for even putting himself in that situation and not advocating the abuse the girl has received might get a better chance of another club signing him without so much heat, afterall if we are going by the law he has done his time.
however the hardline he has taken is nothing short of stupid, he is making himself look very pompous and calous on a technicality, it is hard to feel sorry for him when you look at everything from both angles.
he deserves the right to move on with his life definitely, whether or not that is in football is a different thing entirely.
wise counsel is something that cannot be underestimated, same with discernment, he clearly lacks both.
|
|
|
|
Post by Bestie on Jan 9, 2015 9:46:38 GMT
That's the thing though, he is allowed to continue his career. Nobodies stopped him from getting back in football. The FA, the Premier League, UEFA, FIFA. The only thing stopping him from being a footballer again is no club as of yet has been prepared to hire him. That's no different to any other job, be it plumber, banker, architect, postman, whatever. The law says you can go back to work, and he can. But that doesn't mean an employer has to give him work. If a plumber tried to get a job at a plumbing firm, and told the manager in the interview he'd just been released from prison after being convicted of rape, there's a very good chance he wouldn't be offered the job. Evans is in the same boat as most other jail birds. Nothing stopping you from getting employment apart from your own past. If the FA had come out and openly banned any club from offering him a contract, well, then that would be a whole different can of worms. I agree with you but social media has interjected and is now dictating his future and that has a direct impact on the administration of justice as we used to understand it. If sponsors, clubs and a significant group of society can force an ex-con out of their former career there will be long term repercussions. Last thing anybody wants is this man being made a victim of persecution. The administration of justice by the system has been done though. Societal justice cannot be 'administered' in the same way. We should be persecuting this fraction of a man. He raped someone. You commit a crime, especially one as disgusting and unhuman as rape, then you forfeit your rights to be treated like everyone else. If the law doesn't do a proper job of it, society has to. Maybe if quasi-men know if they rape someone they won't just get some poxy couple of years in prison, but a complete banishment from decent society maybe, just maybe, they'll rethink. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2015 10:05:53 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by smithy2 on Jan 9, 2015 15:21:23 GMT
Have to say when this all came out 5 years ago I remember the papers describing a CCTV video showing the girl unable to walk and being helped in by Ched. Just saw the CCTV footage and that is certainly not the case. She walks in on her own two feet, actually leaves the hotel as she forget her purse in the Taxi and then walks back in with a pizza.
Don't know what went on after that but that is not the series of events the papers talked about.
|
|
_
United School Boy
Posts: 0
|
Ched Evans
Jan 9, 2015 22:21:10 GMT
via mobile
_ likes this
Post by _ on Jan 9, 2015 22:21:10 GMT
Oldham said no to Ched Evans... ...but he's taking it as a yes  |
|
_
United School Boy
100%
Posts: 0
|
Post by _ on Jan 9, 2015 23:39:58 GMT
I agree with you but social media has interjected and is now dictating his future and that has a direct impact on the administration of justice as we used to understand it. If sponsors, clubs and a significant group of society can force an ex-con out of their former career there will be long term repercussions. Last thing anybody wants is this man being made a victim of persecution. The administration of justice by the system has been done though. Societal justice cannot be 'administered' in the same way. We should be persecuting this fraction of a man. He raped someone. You commit a crime, especially one as disgusting and unhuman as rape, then you forfeit your rights to be treated like everyone else. If the law doesn't do a proper job of it, society has to. Maybe if quasi-men know if they rape someone they won't just get some poxy couple of years in prison, but a complete banishment from decent society maybe, just maybe, they'll rethink. Whilst I comprehend your sentiment surely as a lawyer you cannot be advocating a form of life sentence beyond a prison sentence. Although rape and sex offences are dreadful are they really on the same level as murder? Pandering to the crowd is semi-vigilantism which long term would negate the need for lawyers and a justice system. We are facing very difficult moral and ethical questions without the proper rigour of debate and conceding to dubious public opinion. While I find Evans behaviour deplorable he must be offered the opportunity for rehabilitation or the consequences could be quite catastrophic both in the behaviour of rapists, who might consider murdering their victims, and vigilantes who will take the law into their own hands. |
|
|
|
Post by grandpaTJ on Jan 10, 2015 3:24:39 GMT
its a very difficult one. I say that because for me rape is very low, not to advertise or advocate prostitution but if you really want sex that badly pay for it. If your tired of your mrs or partner and want something different you can pay rather than rape, if you can't then pls pls do not stoop so low. In evans case apparently the conviction was on the basis she was so drunk and out of it she couldn't possibly know what was happening, evans sees that as his defense in that it wasn't forceful like is most classic rape cases. Whatever the case may be the law is the law and the law states that what he did is classed as rape. evans really if he was more contrite for even putting himself in that situation and not advocating the abuse the girl has received might get a better chance of another club signing him without so much heat, afterall if we are going by the law he has done his time. however the hardline he has taken is nothing short of stupid, he is making himself look very pompous and calous on a technicality, it is hard to feel sorry for him when you look at everything from both angles. he deserves the right to move on with his life definitely, whether or not that is in football is a different thing entirely. wise counsel is something that cannot be underestimated, same with discernment, he clearly lacks both. Rape is not about sex, it is about control and violence, and in most cases, a hatred of women in general. Last thing a rapist would want is for the pimp to beat the living hell out of him. What I have seen of his "arguments" the guy would be a menace as long as he was on the streets Rapists need to be put under the fooking jail along with Pedophiles and other abusers who do not get nearly the punishment they should get when caught |
|
|
|
Post by mightyez on Jan 10, 2015 9:00:50 GMT
its a very difficult one. I say that because for me rape is very low, not to advertise or advocate prostitution but if you really want sex that badly pay for it. If your tired of your mrs or partner and want something different you can pay rather than rape, if you can't then pls pls do not stoop so low. In evans case apparently the conviction was on the basis she was so drunk and out of it she couldn't possibly know what was happening, evans sees that as his defense in that it wasn't forceful like is most classic rape cases. Whatever the case may be the law is the law and the law states that what he did is classed as rape. evans really if he was more contrite for even putting himself in that situation and not advocating the abuse the girl has received might get a better chance of another club signing him without so much heat, afterall if we are going by the law he has done his time. however the hardline he has taken is nothing short of stupid, he is making himself look very pompous and calous on a technicality, it is hard to feel sorry for him when you look at everything from both angles. he deserves the right to move on with his life definitely, whether or not that is in football is a different thing entirely. wise counsel is something that cannot be underestimated, same with discernment, he clearly lacks both. Rape is not about sex, it is about control and violence, and in most cases, a hatred of women in general. Last thing a rapist would want is for the pimp to beat the living hell out of him. What I have seen of his "arguments" the guy would be a menace as long as he was on the streets Rapists need to be put under the fooking jail along with Pedophiles and other abusers who do not get nearly the punishment they should get when caught i am going by the definition of the law used in the case. for me i think we should all go by the case and try to be subjective to that. I am in no way an advocate for ched evans or what he has done, whatever happened that night he knows and he will live with it all his life way after his career, this will follow him. if we should we andy with anyone its a law system that hands out the sentences. |
|
.
United School Boy
Posts: 0
|
Post by . on Oct 14, 2016 17:09:34 GMT
Ched Evans has had his rape conviction quashed today in court, meaning, he is now considered innocent. The idea that a complainant's sexual history can be admitted as evidence in a rape case is troubling, to say the least. I believe it's not allowed in US courts.
Evans is probably just another player who is dumber than a bag of hammers. At his initial police interview... 'When he was interviewed by police Evans boasted that he and McDonald could have had any woman they wanted in the club that night. “Footballers are rich and they have money,” he said. “That is what girls like.” '
They are rich and have money both.
|
|
|
|
Post by smithy2 on Oct 14, 2016 17:39:20 GMT
Ched Evans has had his rape conviction quashed today in court, meaning, he is now considered innocent. The idea that a complainant's sexual history can be admitted as evidence in a rape case is troubling, to say the least. I believe it's not allowed in US courts. Evans is probably just another player who is dumber than a bag of hammers. At his initial police interview... 'When he was interviewed by police Evans boasted that he and McDonald could have had any woman they wanted in the club that night. “Footballers are rich and they have money,” he said. “That is what girls like.” ' They are rich and have money both. The lad got fucked by the system, society and the media. |
|
|
|
Post by Big_Rons_Leather_Coat on Oct 14, 2016 18:42:59 GMT
Jess Ennis retiring yesterday a day before this today is hardly a coincidence is it? She was public judge and jury on this case. She definitely needs to speak now after this. Evans has been proven innocent.
|
|
|
|
Post by Bestie on Oct 14, 2016 19:16:33 GMT
Have to hold my hands up and say he's had the conviction quashed, so he's innocent. Law's the law. Rape is a hot button topic for me so I tend to go off the deep end but if he didn't do it then mea culpa.
|
|
|
|
Post by Big_Rons_Leather_Coat on Oct 14, 2016 19:21:19 GMT
Have to hold my hands up and say he's had the conviction quashed, so he's innocent. Law's the law. Rape is a hot button topic for me so I tend to go off the deep end but if he didn't do it then mea culpa. Fair play man. |
|
