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Post by WhatsTheMata on Jun 26, 2015 11:17:52 GMT
I suggest we send Argentina to be studied. Even when they have fantastic teams, they lift little to no silverware. However, I would be really surprised if Colombia knocked them out. Their managers recently haven't been great. That, as we sadly know, makes a big difference even to good players. That's a problem faced by South American national teams in general. No team can build an identity by changing their manager at every four years like it is done, I hate that. Germany took 10 years to build a team to win the silverware in 2014, this is unimaginable for AFA. Another thing I never understood very well is the blind pride the population still feel for their national team. If you tell AFA to point out a foreign manager, they'll cut your head. It took Brazil that horrible WC shame to make people consider a foreign manager, to which CBF said no, immediately. Argentina has no such embarrassments as a recent 7-1. Plain and simple - to South American nations who carry World Cups on their backs, nothing but winning another one is acceptable, otherwise almost everyone is labeled as crap. Argentina has this mentality too. Then, to try to please the angry fans after a disqualification in a competition, corrupted federations bring in known names - look at the rotation of Scolari/Parreira/Dunga/Gallo in Brazil. Maradona when appointed to coach Argentina. Uruguay keeps counting old glories, is thirsty to have them back. Then you have teams of less expression - like Chile and Colombia - that want to match those three very badly. The goal record counting by England with no expressive trophies is something that shocked me a little at first to be honest. If you tell that to an Argentinian, they'll tell you "ok but what trophies did he bring home?" Messi will be remembered as one of the greatest, but there will ALWAYS be "Messi or Maradona?" If he doesn't bring the cup home. One thing is on their favor though - the streets get very cheerful at those times  visit Argentina as a Brazilian and vice versa around those times is very interesting and fun. All of this is sad indeed, but it still surprises me how Argentina gets NOTHING. I can't remember the last time they won something important. |
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Post by WhatsTheMata on Jun 26, 2015 11:23:36 GMT
Their managers recently haven't been great. That, as we sadly know, makes a big difference even to good players. same with brazil... I'm Brazilian, but no way the situation is alike. Argentina is a far better team nowadays, real proven talent. Brazil has a boring team, still love them, but we currently suck. Sure, there's still hope, we have some promising youngsters like Pereira and Danilo, however, nothing very concrete yet. Do you know how sad it is to have David Luiz there? |
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Post by ZlattackRed on Jun 26, 2015 11:27:24 GMT
I'm Brazilian, but no way the situation is alike. Argentina is a far better team nowadays, real proven talent. Brazil has a boring team, still love them, but we currently suck. Sure, there's still hope, we have some promising youngsters like Pereira and Danilo, however, nothing very concrete yet. Do you know how sad it is to have David Luiz there? Totally agree with you on this. Brazil are a pale shadow of the glory years whereas Argentina are oozing with talent, but clearly under-performing. |
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Post by WhatsTheMata on Jun 26, 2015 11:46:14 GMT
I'm Brazilian, but no way the situation is alike. Argentina is a far better team nowadays, real proven talent. Brazil has a boring team, still love them, but we currently suck. Sure, there's still hope, we have some promising youngsters like Pereira and Danilo, however, nothing very concrete yet. Do you know how sad it is to have David Luiz there? Totally agree with you on this. Brazil are a pale shadow of the glory years whereas Argentina are oozing with talent, but clearly under-performing. They always are, somebody jinxed Argentina very badly. With a front three of Messi, Aguero and Di Maria alongside Rojo, Otamendi and Mascherano shouldn't draw Paraguay. Not even a bad manager explains that. Colombia will be out tonight, no Bacca, no Sanchez and a struggling Falcao. The fucking shit is that I won't be able to watch that. |
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Post by swimmityswim on Jun 26, 2015 11:54:20 GMT
I'm Brazilian, but no way the situation is alike. Argentina is a far better team nowadays, real proven talent. Brazil has a boring team, still love them, but we currently suck. Sure, there's still hope, we have some promising youngsters like Pereira and Danilo, however, nothing very concrete yet. Do you know how sad it is to have David Luiz there? Totally agree with you on this. Brazil are a pale shadow of the glory years whereas Argentina are oozing with talent, but clearly under-performing. i meant moreso a team being limited by their manager. there is undoubted talent available from brazilian born players but the players that are chosen for the national team are uninspiring to say the least. not even neymar has the vision and creativity of a ronaldinho or ronaldo or rivaldo. |
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Post by WhatsTheMata on Jun 26, 2015 12:15:21 GMT
Totally agree with you on this. Brazil are a pale shadow of the glory years whereas Argentina are oozing with talent, but clearly under-performing. i meant moreso a team being limited by their manager. there is undoubted talent available from brazilian born players but the players that are chosen for the national team are uninspiring to say the least. not even neymar has the vision and creativity of a ronaldinho or ronaldo or rivaldo. This. My local team was the Brazilian star of Copa Libertadores, names who were hailed - Dourado, Sasha and Valdivia -weren't called up. Roberto Firmino has been contributing with Hoffenheim for ages, but only now he gets noticed. Tardelli is a bottler who plays in CHINA but he was liked at Atletico MG and Everton Ribeiro wasted his talent moving to the Arab league but loved at Cruzeiro. That's another populist technique - bring in the most known players, the ones whose names cause impact on people. I don't understand (I actually don't want to) why Miranda and Coutinho weren't called up for the World Cup. Coutinho is too decent to play for the mob by the way, he should get out of Liverpool as soon as possible. |
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Post by Stew on Jun 26, 2015 12:17:54 GMT
i meant moreso a team being limited by their manager. there is undoubted talent available from brazilian born players but the players that are chosen for the national team are uninspiring to say the least. not even neymar has the vision and creativity of a ronaldinho or ronaldo or rivaldo. This. My local team was the Brazilian star of Copa Libertadores, names who were hailed - Dourado, Sasha and Valdivia -weren't called up. Roberto Firmino has been contributing with Hoffenheim for ages, but only now he gets noticed. Tardelli is a bottler who plays in CHINA but he was liked at Atletico MG and Everton Ribeiro wasted his talent moving to the Arab league but loved at Cruzeiro. That's another populist technique - bring in the most known players, the ones whose names cause impact on people. I don't understand (I actually don't want to) why Miranda and Coutinho weren't called up for the World Cup. Coutinho is too decent to play for the mob by the way, he should get out of Liverpool as soon as possible. Do they suspend that for the Copa? last i saw was that insane match when the guy used pepper stray on the oppo team. That was the 1/4s I think? |
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Post by WhatsTheMata on Jun 26, 2015 12:25:12 GMT
This. My local team was the Brazilian star of Copa Libertadores, names who were hailed - Dourado, Sasha and Valdivia -weren't called up. Roberto Firmino has been contributing with Hoffenheim for ages, but only now he gets noticed. Tardelli is a bottler who plays in CHINA but he was liked at Atletico MG and Everton Ribeiro wasted his talent moving to the Arab league but loved at Cruzeiro. That's another populist technique - bring in the most known players, the ones whose names cause impact on people. I don't understand (I actually don't want to) why Miranda and Coutinho weren't called up for the World Cup. Coutinho is too decent to play for the mob by the way, he should get out of Liverpool as soon as possible. Do they suspend that for the Copa? last i saw was that insane match when the guy used pepper stray on the oppo team. That was the 1/4s I think? Yes, it's suspended. It's settled to come back at the 14th, River Plate v Guarani-PAR and SC Inter v Tigres on the 15th. There's always craziness from the crowd at Copa Libertadores, it's like the whole stadium is the stretford end, signing, making noises etc. but it's lessening, I fear for the death of the atmosphere. Sure, Boca Juniors deserved the elimination due to their behavior, but La Bombonera is a scary stadium to go as an away fan, it's thrilling Edit: I might be biased, but it's an underrated competition |
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Post by WhatsTheMata on Jun 27, 2015 1:41:20 GMT
Dramatic classification by Argentina
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Post by ZlattackRed on Jun 27, 2015 5:09:44 GMT
Dramatic classification by Argentina ADM had lot of the ball, with Messi releasing him time and again, but the final delivery was lacking. Still not in the best of form. Aguero had a disappointing night. Its surprising how this lot is hanging by the skin of the teeth. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2015 10:04:21 GMT
Colombia put in some great tackles on Messi. Said this earlier in the season (can't remember who it was against then) whenever teams actually tackle him he does struggle. Unfortunately most defenders are too scared.
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Post by Stew on Jun 27, 2015 14:11:35 GMT
Another game Argentina should have won 3 or 4 nil.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2015 14:28:30 GMT
Another game Argentina should have won 3 or 4 nil. Ospina played a blinder.... |
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Post by Stew on Jun 27, 2015 14:30:58 GMT
Another game Argentina should have won 3 or 4 nil. Ospina played a blinder.... He did but it seems to be a real problem with them. And it'll cost them eventually. I'm hoping they win because it'll do wonders for our lads confidence, particularly Di Maria you'd think. Sorry to our Brazilian friend! |
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Post by JamBritRed on Jun 27, 2015 14:47:17 GMT
Dramatic classification by Argentina ADM had lot of the ball, with Messi releasing him time and again, but the final delivery was lacking. Still not in the best of form. Aguero had a disappointing night. Its surprising how this lot is hanging by the skin of the teeth. to be fair, his delivery from set pieces wasn't too bad. didnt realise Argentina play the formation that the Boss want's to play. that back three of Garay, Mascherano (apart from his time with the scum, i'd say i love this guy, immense!) and Otamendi seemed thoroughly in control. i can see why LvG wants Otamendi, he never put a foot wrong last night, and assisted in the build up play when needed. but Mascherano though....  (i know i blaspheme, but i cant help it  ) |
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