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United School Boy
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Post by . on Nov 12, 2018 3:25:15 GMT
Didn’t expect to beat Juve, didn’t expect to beat City. The score line didn’t tell the whole story. I’m relieved we weren’t given a chasing like the 6-1 .
The frightening part is how spent our squad looks. You wouldn’t think this was only early November. Matic is no longer magic. Pogba would have helped but City probably would have taken it up a gear. We don’t have a game-changer or talisman in the side. Bunch of grafters but no stars.
If Fred and Bailly are iced out for good we have a massive rebuild on our hands. Will the Board sanction hundreds of millions in January just to chase the CL spots, or will they allow this team to run on vapors and pray? I don’t see us getting higher than 5th, and DeGea is no 5th place keeper. How do we keep him without signaling a huge spend, and how do we sanction Jose’s fantasy football instincts?
I’m back to thinking Jose will be gone before the January window.
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Post by mightyez on Nov 12, 2018 5:25:13 GMT
The debate between sourness and g nev was fab.
Both correct mind you.
Gary in that structurally there is a problem, souness in that the manager is not getting the best out of the players.
There are duds in that team but there are also some players that other managers would have looking like world beaters.
I still go back to the beginning, Jose came in with a lot of authority and hindsight is a wonderful thing but i’d Have gone crazy that summer with a serious clearout, it should have been in his contract.
There are just too many players sadly that look better playing elsewhere.
Did we get Sanchez and Fred in fear of city getting them? What has pereira done? It’s not his fault he was played out of position. Surely Bailly is better than mike? List goes on, lots of questions to be asked
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 6:03:38 GMT
Would love to say this was a surprise. Never a chance with that midfield. Herrera was awful. Matic is exactly what he has been for most of his stay. And Tree ... its just criminal at this stage. Mourinho has his hands full now. Maybe he can start getting things right.He hasn't done this for 2 seasons, can't see it starting any time soon. All the blame can't be put at his feet but the way he lined us up yesterday was typical of him. We weren't as defensive as we have been but we still go into games like this. We've had far worse results and performances to be fair but he's not learning from his mistakes. One good game is always followed by one of two shit ones. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 6:16:02 GMT
And to think some thought the result against Juve was a turning point  We are stuck with this shite until he’s fucked off. You trust dear leader to get the next one right? I admire your optimism! Are you suggesting sticking with Jose until we have a new ownership? Perhaps a fan poll to choose the next manager?
Ed didn't lose us the derby just like he didn't score the winner on Wednesday. Argue what you like about the state of the club but Jose should be judged on how well he uses his squad, and whether he gets the best out of his players. By saying his players I refer mostly to those he purchased for tons of money.
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Post by juanveron on Nov 12, 2018 6:32:22 GMT
In regards to the Juve game being a turning point, I think that it's a little hard to compare Juve and City because the two teams play such a different type of football.
Juve is a much more traditional super team, and while they are better than us, we did manage to contain them well in Turin - to the point where I dare say we're not THAT far from their level. City, on the other hand, play the kind of football we really struggled to cope with even when Ferguson was our manager and our team was far better (the 2009 CL final comes to mind and still stings). I don't know how you stop them, but it's probably down to an extremely well-organized defense and super lethal forwards.
I suspect that the biggest source of frustration for Jose is that this isn't an even playing field - he must think that if he was given the same freedom Pep has to make squad choices, he would be able to do what Pep is doing at City. Therefore, Jose will not view the outcome of his time here as a failure (even if he's sacked tomorrow), because how could he possibly compete with a guy who can buy 3 fullbacks in one summer? In a way, he will probably be right. The reason many are irked by this is that he did spend a huge chunk of money and most of his transfers have failed. That being said, if we do stick with Jose, let him buy the 4-5 players he wants and let's see what happens. If we don't plan to support him - then fucking replace him, what's the fucking point?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 6:45:07 GMT
Excuses are being made for Mourinho about him getting the players he wants. He's had them already over the past 2 1/2 years, £400m being wasted in the process so how much more does he need to spend before we start challenging for the title abd not battling with Bournemouth ffs.
We started the game against the best team in the country with a midfield of Matic, Herrera and Fellaini, we were always going to struggle. What I don't understand is after Wed night why he didn't start with Sanchez and Mata. Confidence should have been high after that game but they all let themselves down again.
We have Pereira and Fred available and he starts Matic who badly needs a rest. For me Pereira has done fuck all to deserve being left out in the cold (unless I've missed an injury somewhere) and Fred seems a waste of money as he's not being used.
These are simple fucking mistakes that he's doing over and over again. City would have been laughing their arses off seeing that starting XI.
We mustered one attempt on target in the whole game. One! Lingard did very little to the point I forgot he was even on the pitch, Martial was trying to do everything because he hardly ever had any support and Rashford was wasteful yet again.
Same shit different day.
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Post by mightyez on Nov 12, 2018 6:51:01 GMT
I think the key difference between us, Liverpool and city is the approach.
They buy players that fit their system, style and way of play.
We sadly don’t have a system, style or way of play therefore we have really just bought in a haphazard way.
Couple that with the fact the good players we have bought just aren’t playing at their real level for reasons such as poor coaching, lack of effort, poor mentality etc it all adds up with us looking rather poor.
A mind change from the players and coaches, and a re structure is desperately needed, not in January not in the summer, it’s needed today
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United School Boy
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Post by . on Nov 12, 2018 6:59:01 GMT
Just a quick one before I go to work.
If somebody on here attempts to call me out by putting my name on a list alongside other members, like what occurred earlier in this thread, well then of course I'm going to defend myself.
At the same time, if it's a turd of a performance like yesterday don't expect me to polish it. The End.
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Post by juanveron on Nov 12, 2018 7:01:23 GMT
Excuses are being made for Mourinho about him getting the players he wants. He's had them already over the past 2 1/2 years, £400m being wasted in the process so how much more does he need to spend before we start challenging for the title abd not battling with Bournemouth ffs. We started the game against the best team in the country with a midfield of Matic, Herrera and Fellaini, we were always going to struggle. What I don't understand is after Wed night why he didn't start with Sanchez and Mata. Confidence should have been high after that game but they all let themselves down again. We have Pereira and Fred available and he starts Matic who badly needs a rest. For me Pereira has done fuck all to deserve being left out in the cold (unless I've missed an injury somewhere) and Fred seems a waste of money as he's not being used. These are simple fucking mistakes that he's doing over and over again. City would have been laughing their arses off seeing that starting XI. We mustered one attempt on target in the whole game. One! Lingard did very little to the point I forgot he was even on the pitch, Martial was trying to do everything because he hardly ever had any support and Rashford was wasteful yet again. Same shit different day. Yeah.. that midfield selection was baffling, to say the least. I actually thought Matic doing a good job against Juventus would come back to bite us in the ass here because that meant he'll play for sure and will also be even more lethargic than usual. I think Jose played both Rashford and Lingard because they are local lads and thus would have an extra incentive to have a good game. Made sense in theory, but in reality, they were both very poor. Rashford in particular for me has regressed dramatically, he's just turned 21 but I think he was a lot better when he was 18,19. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 7:04:37 GMT
Would love to say this was a surprise. Never a chance with that midfield. Herrera was awful. Matic is exactly what he has been for most of his stay. And Tree ... its just criminal at this stage. Mourinho has his hands full now. Maybe he can start getting things right.He hasn't done this for 2 seasons, can't see it starting any time soon. All the blame can't be put at his feet but the way he lined us up yesterday was typical of him. We weren't as defensive as we have been but we still go into games like this. We've had far worse results and performances to be fair but he's not learning from his mistakes. One good game is always followed by one of two shit ones. He's far from the only one to blame, I think everyone would agree to that. Question is can he improve us? It would also be weird to start changing the standard to suit Mourinho for some reason. He's shown he always struggle about 3 years in but he gets given more leeway than our previous two managers. Van Gaal was boring but finished fourth and 1 point off 4th with an FA cup. That's starting to look pretty good. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 7:52:14 GMT
Excuses are being made for Mourinho about him getting the players he wants. He's had them already over the past 2 1/2 years, £400m being wasted in the process so how much more does he need to spend before we start challenging for the title abd not battling with Bournemouth ffs. We started the game against the best team in the country with a midfield of Matic, Herrera and Fellaini, we were always going to struggle. What I don't understand is after Wed night why he didn't start with Sanchez and Mata. Confidence should have been high after that game but they all let themselves down again. We have Pereira and Fred available and he starts Matic who badly needs a rest. For me Pereira has done fuck all to deserve being left out in the cold (unless I've missed an injury somewhere) and Fred seems a waste of money as he's not being used. These are simple fucking mistakes that he's doing over and over again. City would have been laughing their arses off seeing that starting XI. We mustered one attempt on target in the whole game. One! Lingard did very little to the point I forgot he was even on the pitch, Martial was trying to do everything because he hardly ever had any support and Rashford was wasteful yet again. Same shit different day. Yeah.. that midfield selection was baffling, to say the least. I actually thought Matic doing a good job against Juventus would come back to bite us in the ass here because that meant he'll play for sure and will also be even more lethargic than usual. I think Jose played both Rashford and Lingard because they are local lads and thus would have an extra incentive to have a good game. Made sense in theory, but in reality, they were both very poor. Rashford in particular for me has regressed dramatically, he's just turned 21 but I think he was a lot better when he was 18,19. When we play a midfield three of Herrera, Matic and Fellaini I cannot blame any forward for being poor. We offer zero threat from midfield, bar tree from set pieces, which makes our forward line easy prey for any defense. When Pogba is out we have absolutely no one to take the ball from the back four and drive it through midfield so we end up hoofing it forward and more often than not, losing possession. When both Martial and Lingard are instructed to protect their FB we have Rashford up front against the entire City defense. At some stages during that first half it was embarrassing to see how advanced the City CBs were, strolling some 40-50 yards from DDG as we offered practically zero threat. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 7:54:34 GMT
He hasn't done this for 2 seasons, can't see it starting any time soon. All the blame can't be put at his feet but the way he lined us up yesterday was typical of him. We weren't as defensive as we have been but we still go into games like this. We've had far worse results and performances to be fair but he's not learning from his mistakes. One good game is always followed by one of two shit ones. He's far from the only one to blame, I think everyone would agree to that. Question is can he improve us? It would also be weird to start changing the standard to suit Mourinho for some reason. He's shown he always struggle about 3 years in but he gets given more leeway than our previous two managers. Van Gaal was boring but finished fourth and 1 point off 4th with an FA cup. That's starting to look pretty good.Jose isn't doing a very good job, but I wouldn't go that far. LVG signed some serious mediocrity. Fuck that, he got beat 4-0 at MK Dons ffs. |
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Post by WhatsTheMata on Nov 12, 2018 8:03:02 GMT
You can’t complain about Matic if consistency is what you’re looking for, he’s been consistent (consistently bad). He gifted City twice.
We had difficulties going forward, and yes Sanchez might have been more prolific centred than on the left but that means shit when he has done fuck all there. Guardiola subbed in Gundogan to waste time and it ended up with him scoring after over 40 passes and that fucking “olé!” chants. The response from Jose? Fellaini started so he couldn’t execute his plan b and turn the match around.
Sometimes, for being bad at football bar chest control, he (Fellaini) gets less praise for some performances than he deserves but to have him as the team’s game changer is another story. Did he do it a couple of times? Yes. Is it enough to hold this position in the eyes of the manager? No.
I really believed we could win. I want Mourinho gone asap, but no man is bigger than Manchester United and I’ll be happy for Jose and praise him when he deserves (re Juve) because his success is our success. Sadly there’s not much there bar that occasional joy in Turin and then back to this.
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Post by WhatsTheMata on Nov 12, 2018 8:04:00 GMT
He's far from the only one to blame, I think everyone would agree to that. Question is can he improve us? It would also be weird to start changing the standard to suit Mourinho for some reason. He's shown he always struggle about 3 years in but he gets given more leeway than our previous two managers. Van Gaal was boring but finished fourth and 1 point off 4th with an FA cup. That's starting to look pretty good.Jose isn't doing a very good job, but I wouldn't go that far. LVG signed some serious mediocrity. Fuck that, he got beat 4-0 at MK Dons ffs. With a youth team. We lost to Bristol City with our full potential. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 8:19:04 GMT
Jose isn't doing a very good job, but I wouldn't go that far. LVG signed some serious mediocrity. Fuck that, he got beat 4-0 at MK Dons ffs. With a youth team. We lost to Bristol City with our full potential. 36 Marnick Vermijl 6 Jonny Evans (c)38 Michael Keane 41 Reece James 51' 37 Saidy Janko 46' 28 Anderson26 Shinji Kagawa 20'22 Nick Powell 57'19 Danny Welbeck
14 Javier Hernández
Not an inspiring line up but hardly a youth team. Anyway, MK Dons was just one example of the good old LVG days. Of course Jose's tenure is littered with shit displays too, but he won more trophies in his first season than LVG ever did for us.
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