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Post by GeniusCantona on Mar 18, 2019 13:41:14 GMT
Then you must be watching a different United. Well I agree with him so we must be sharing the same TV? “But this happened under Sir Alex”, wasn’t this your argument on occasion when we had a string of bad results under Jose? Now that Ole has had 2 losses where’s that argument now? Didn’t this happen under Sir Alex as well? I suppose only when it suits your opinion. |
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Post by Karma on Mar 18, 2019 13:48:57 GMT
Well I agree with him so we must be sharing the same TV? “But this happened under Sir Alex”, wasn’t this your argument on occasion when we had a string of bad results under Jose? Now that Ole has had 2 losses where’s that argument now? Didn’t this happen under Sir Alex as well? I suppose only when it suits your opinion. I got grief on here for the poll for Ole some time back! My doubts were there long before the last 2 games! As I have suggested I’m not convinced long term he is the answer! The difference with Jose and Ole is that he has a huge collection of trophies to fall back on. Ole is an unknown quantity! Same thing with Moyes. No CV to fall back on if things got tough! Take sentiment out of it none of us know how this is going to turn out. |
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Post by RAZ on Mar 18, 2019 13:54:08 GMT
“But this happened under Sir Alex”, wasn’t this your argument on occasion when we had a string of bad results under Jose? Now that Ole has had 2 losses where’s that argument now? Didn’t this happen under Sir Alex as well? I suppose only when it suits your opinion. I got grief on here for the poll for Ole some time back! My doubts were there long before the last 2 games! As I have suggested I’m not convinced long term he is the answer! dont remember after which game you came out and said that you changed your mind on ole and you wanted him in but you did. but go on karma. do you actually ever come out after a win and talk something positive? |
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Post by alt on Mar 18, 2019 13:54:57 GMT
It's not based on this slight dip in form, it's based on everything we've seen up to this point. Then you must be watching a different United. Obviously, as every single person who's watched Ole's games up to now clearly all have the same opinion. Can't be fucked to continue this conversation so if you feel the need to enlighten me with anything else don't expect a response. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2019 13:58:10 GMT
So what’s the reasoning then? The turnaround has been fantastic. Every team has a dip in form. Because as well as Ole has done, he's yet to convince me that tactically, he can get us competing with the very best again. We've had a great run of results and he deserves plenty of credit for it, but man management has played a massive part in this upturn. He's taken a squad of unhappy, demotivated players and got them playing again which was always going to produce results. Teams are adapting to the way we play and starting to somewhat nullify our approach, so it's going to be a big test for Ole to see if he can evolve the way we play. If he can start to show that before the end of the season then maybe I'll start to think differently, but for now, I'm very much still in the mindset that for long term, Pochettino is right choice. I don't think it's teams adapting to how we play rather than piss poor performances from the players. We've played numerous ways since he arrived anyway due to the catastrophic run of injuries we've endured. I'm on the other side of the fence, I'm still waiting for Pochettino to convince me he is the right man for the job. |
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Post by Karma on Mar 18, 2019 14:01:44 GMT
I got grief on here for the poll for Ole some time back! My doubts were there long before the last 2 games! As I have suggested I’m not convinced long term he is the answer! dont remember after which game you came out and said that you changed your mind on ole and you wanted him in but you did. but go on karma. do you actually ever come out after a win and talk something positive? That was PSG which was understandable and immediately after the game. Probably not the best time to make a judgment call. I have said time and time again who I wanted to replace Jose . It hasn’t changed! I know it’s hard for some to accept but we don’t all think the same way!🙄🙄 |
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Post by RAZ on Mar 18, 2019 14:04:12 GMT
dont remember after which game you came out and said that you changed your mind on ole and you wanted him in but you did. but go on karma. do you actually ever come out after a win and talk something positive? That was PSG which was understandable and immediately after the game. Probably not the best time to make a judgment call!just as the last two games are probably not the best time to make a judgement call |
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Post by Karma on Mar 18, 2019 14:05:37 GMT
That was PSG which was understandable and immediately after the game. Probably not the best time to make a judgment call!just as the last two games are probably not the best time to make a judgement call I got grief on the Ole thread which was long before these last 2 games and well before the PSG game but do continue. |
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Post by RAZ on Mar 18, 2019 14:12:44 GMT
just as the last two games are probably not the best time to make a judgement call I got grief on the Ole thread which was long before these last 2 games and well before the PSG game but do continue. the problem here lies within the constant change of opinion. which is absolutely fine, we all change our opinions but dont be surprised to get called out if one day you`re not convinced by ole, then you are convinced and after 2 losses you dont want him again. as you said the psg game was not the best time to make a judgement call, well the last two games are also not. we`ve won 14 out of 19 games i think. we`ve had fantastic performances, lucky performances and very few really bad games. all teams have that. however if you look at all the performances, results and stats together there would be not one team in the world who would be against a manager who achieved those things. ole got some things wrong recently and some players who simply didnt show up. we`ve done fantastic while having up to 10 players out at the same time, beat some good teams. played horrible at wolves but lost to a strong team. all in all its quite difficult to say he doesnt deserve the job. but extremely important for him to succeed is a DoF and the players he wants. he earned the chance for a full season with support in the summer. |
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Post by Karma on Mar 18, 2019 14:16:44 GMT
I got grief on the Ole thread which was long before these last 2 games and well before the PSG game but do continue. the problem here lies within the constant change of opinion. which is absolutely fine, we all change our opinions but dont be surprised to get called out if one day you`re not convinced by ole, then you are convinced and after 2 losses you dont want him again. as you said the psg game was not the best time to make a judgement call, well the last two games are also not. we`ve won 14 out of 19 games i think. we`ve had fantastic performances, lucky performances and very few really bad games. all teams have that. however if you look at all the performances, results and stats together there would be not one team in the world who would be against a manager who achieved those things. ole got some things wrong recently and some players who simply didnt show up. we`ve done fantastic while having up to 10 players out at the same time, beat some good teams. played horrible at wolves but lost to a strong team. all in all its quite difficult to say he doesnt deserve the job. but extremely important for him to succeed is a DoF and the players he wants. he earned the chance for a full season with support in the summer. Go and read over the Ole thread if you think I’ve constantly changed my opinion. I haven’t I have been consistent ! My opinions are pretty consistent generally, it’s what I get most of my grief on here for so please stop making stuff up Thanks! |
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Post by RAZ on Mar 18, 2019 14:29:11 GMT
the problem here lies within the constant change of opinion. which is absolutely fine, we all change our opinions but dont be surprised to get called out if one day you`re not convinced by ole, then you are convinced and after 2 losses you dont want him again. as you said the psg game was not the best time to make a judgement call, well the last two games are also not. we`ve won 14 out of 19 games i think. we`ve had fantastic performances, lucky performances and very few really bad games. all teams have that. however if you look at all the performances, results and stats together there would be not one team in the world who would be against a manager who achieved those things. ole got some things wrong recently and some players who simply didnt show up. we`ve done fantastic while having up to 10 players out at the same time, beat some good teams. played horrible at wolves but lost to a strong team. all in all its quite difficult to say he doesnt deserve the job. but extremely important for him to succeed is a DoF and the players he wants. he earned the chance for a full season with support in the summer. Go and read over the Ole thread if you think I’ve constantly changed my opinion. I haven’t I have been consistent ! My opinions are pretty consistent generally, it’s what I get most of my grief on here for so please stop making stuff up Thanks! i dont have to make stuff up. from you`re not convinced to give ole what he wants in the summer, to bashing him again. not that difficult to read. other than that, yes you get grief in here for your consistency regarding other opinions. |
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Post by Karma on Mar 18, 2019 14:35:45 GMT
Go and read over the Ole thread if you think I’ve constantly changed my opinion. I haven’t I have been consistent ! My opinions are pretty consistent generally, it’s what I get most of my grief on here for so please stop making stuff up Thanks! i dont have to make stuff up. from you`re not convinced to give ole what he wants in the summer, to bashing him again. not that difficult to read. other than that, yes you get grief in here for your consistency regarding other opinions. I get grief because I’m stubborn and I don’t change my opinion easily. I don’t agree with people to be popular. If I don’t rate someone I will say so I could care less if I’m in the minority ! |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2019 15:45:20 GMT
The question to ask is who would have done a better job than Ole so far? Maybe another manager would have put Wolves to bed, but blown the PSG tie. It's all hypothetical anyway. I don't think another manager would have done as well as Ole has done, but we'll never know.
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Post by Rustin Cohle on Mar 18, 2019 17:08:25 GMT
The question to ask is who would have done a better job than Ole so far? Maybe another manager would have put Wolves to bed, but blown the PSG tie. It's all hypothetical anyway. I don't think another manager would have done as well as Ole has done, but we'll never know. I don't think anyone would have done better, bar perhaps Fergie himself returning, which isn't realistic anyway. But I think the question to ask is more about the future. It's unfair on Ole, but it's fair to ask whether the guy who fixes short-term issues is the right guy for the long term. The classic example is how Di Matteo won the Champions League, but he was not the right option for them beyond that season. Not saying Ole will be like that, but I think it's fair to ask about it. Different managers and styles suit different situations. Guardiola is perfect for a team with a shitload of money and who are happy to play in a certain way. He takes the best players and makes them even better. He is absolutely not perfect for a club with limited resources who are fighting a relegation battle, and that kind of club would be better off appointing someone else in a certain situation. That doesn't make Guardiola a bad manager; it's just a recognition that being excellent at one job doesn't mean you should take another. Perhaps Ole is perfect for a short term lift at a club he has a connection with, but less well-suited to building a squad and dealing with a crap board. What he's done so far has been fantastic, but arguably gives us little insight into those points. I think it's unquestionable that, based on what he has done so far, Ole deserves a crack at the job. But deserving things isn't always enough at this level, particularly when we have fucked up our past three appointments and every failed one makes us more and more like 1990s Liverpool. I'm not saying we shouldn't appoint him, just that this is a fucking huge appointment and the costs of getting it wrong are severe, and that there are valid questions to ask around it all, including whether getting a good manager is enough at all given the shitshow board we have. Maybe the truth is just that no one can win us a title so long as the board have no ambition to do so. |
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Post by weetomsligaments on Mar 18, 2019 17:16:34 GMT
The question to ask is who would have done a better job than Ole so far? Maybe another manager would have put Wolves to bed, but blown the PSG tie. It's all hypothetical anyway. I don't think another manager would have done as well as Ole has done, but we'll never know. I don't think anyone would have done better, bar perhaps Fergie himself returning, which isn't realistic anyway. But I think the question to ask is more about the future. It's unfair on Ole, but it's fair to ask whether the guy who fixes short-term issues is the right guy for the long term. The classic example is how Di Matteo won the Champions League, but he was not the right option for them beyond that season. Not saying Ole will be like that, but I think it's fair to ask about it. Different managers and styles suit different situations. Guardiola is perfect for a team with a shitload of money and who are happy to play in a certain way. He takes the best players and makes them even better. He is absolutely not perfect for a club with limited resources who are fighting a relegation battle, and that kind of club would be better off appointing someone else in a certain situation. That doesn't make Guardiola a bad manager; it's just a recognition that being excellent at one job doesn't mean you should take another. Perhaps Ole is perfect for a short term lift at a club he has a connection with, but less well-suited to building a squad and dealing with a crap board. What he's done so far has been fantastic, but arguably gives us little insight into those points. I think it's unquestionable that, based on what he has done so far, Ole deserves a crack at the job. But deserving things isn't always enough at this level, particularly when we have fucked up our past three appointments and every failed one makes us more and more like 1990s Liverpool. I'm not saying we shouldn't appoint him, just that this is a fucking huge appointment and the costs of getting it wrong are severe, and that there are valid questions to ask around it all, including whether getting a good manager is enough at all given the shitshow board we have. Maybe the truth is just that no one can win us a title so long as the board have no ambition to do so. All perfectly thought out points and well made. Its Ole's job if he can get Pogba to stay long term and play less like he did against Wolves. |
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