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Post by Stretty on May 27, 2024 11:05:15 GMT
He’s been shit all season but he still got picked in the final which shifted garnacho to the right and left his 80 million pound signing benched. Perhaps proving he's learned a lesson with Antony. No he didn’t. he signed mount a year later.
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Post by Jayrannasaurus on May 27, 2024 11:06:16 GMT
Perhaps proving he's learned a lesson with Antony. No he didn’t. he signed mount a year later. I honestly don't understand how this is related?
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Post by Stretty on May 27, 2024 11:14:36 GMT
No he didn’t. he signed mount a year later. I honestly don't understand how this is related? 150 million on 2 players who have not improved the team in any way(throw onana in there and it’s 200 million). his signings(bar Rasmus and Martinez)have been generally shit. how’s tactics are generally shit. in game management is generally shit. we finished 8th ffs with a negative goal difference. what other supposedly top club would put up with that.
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Post by Jayrannasaurus on May 27, 2024 11:21:45 GMT
You insinuated players had downed tools (referencing Rashford and Sancho), I pointed out he dropped Antony yesterday (who he had been playing despite being shit).
Your reply then veered off into signing Mason Mount, and how bad Ten Hag's signings have been. Everyone acknowledges this, and the hope is we have proper recruitment in place now.
Anyway - whether you and I want ETH to stay or not, we'll need to get over the decision eventually.
Personally, I'm tired of the sacking cycle but happy to back whoever is managing United (other than Southgate).
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Post by Kojak on May 27, 2024 11:28:50 GMT
Re the mention of Jose a few pages back.
He also signed absolute dross. Loads of it.
We knew what he was trying to do - yep, play horrendous football.
He had lost the whole dressing room. Erik has not, we saw this on Saturday.
We’re more forgiving of managers we like - Probably human instinct this and Jose was a miserable cunt.
I was fully in favour of replacing Ten Hag prior to the FA Cup win and even now I wouldn’t kick up a stink if they replaced him. I was just providing logical argument.
But come on. Stop comparing everything to José. It’s honestly pathetic at this point that people would have him back. It’s like a cult.
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Post by DedRevil on May 27, 2024 11:35:29 GMT
Re the mention of Jose a few pages back. He also signed absolute dross. Loads of it. We knew what he was trying to do - yep, play horrendous football. He had lost the whole dressing room. Erik has not, we saw this on Saturday. We’re more forgiving of managers we like - Probably human instinct this and Jose was a miserable cunt. I was fully in favour of replacing Ten Hag prior to the FA Cup win and even now I wouldn’t kick up a stink if they replaced him. I was just providing logical argument. But come on. Stop comparing everything to José. It’s honestly pathetic at this point that people would have him back. It’s like a cult. Who would have him back lol?
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Post by caino on May 27, 2024 11:36:20 GMT
Jose was never fully on board, hence his decision to live in a hotel. i dont blame him to be honest the board was tragic with him. if he had new owners and board it could have been different.
the club has enough decisions to get right this summer with board and player signings. leave the manager to it for 6 months and if its not working change. the manager knows all the players now if they change its back to square one.
ETH has had the better of Slot when they have played, won more than arteta and poch and just beat Pep in a final. theres enough noise surrounding other clubs we should be calm and get the structure correct before firing another manager.
non of the candidates are stand out better. Poch possibly but hes won fuck all with arguably better sides.
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Post by Stretty on May 27, 2024 11:38:01 GMT
You insinuated players had downed tools (referencing Rashford and Sancho), I pointed out he dropped Antony yesterday (who he had been playing despite being shit). Your reply then veered off into signing Mason Mount, and how bad Ten Hag's signings have been. Everyone acknowledges this, and the hope is we have proper recruitment in place now. Anyway - whether you and I want ETH to stay or not, we'll need to get over the decision eventually. Personally, I'm tired of the sacking cycle but happy to back whoever is managing United (other than Southgate). Top clubs hire and fire managers all the time. They don’t tolerate low standards and will be ruthless if there is a hint of that happening. for some reason quit a chunk of our fanbase seem to have this ‘holier than thou’ attitude on how we operate(ex players being involved in the setup,the next Fergie,not a sacking club etc.etc.). This way of thinking leads to hiring a manager who spectacularly failed at Cardiff but was hired because he was a club legend(good move by the glazers because they knew our sentimental fan base would not turn on him). I want us to be at the top table of football but to do that we have to act like a big club not a village cricket team.
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Post by viking22 on May 27, 2024 11:41:32 GMT
Agree with the above (although poor recruitment isn't entirely on him and clearly if he stays he will be given far less influence over who we sign). League performance was clearly poor and he dealt badly with the injury crisis and failed to change the tactics to give our makeshift defences more protection and didn't manage to get our attack to gel.
But trophies are the lifeblood of this club and the realistic alternatives are Tuchel, Pochettino, Frank, McKenna and Southgate.
Only one of those I would back to win any trophies for us is Tuchel. But this season he finished 3rd in the Bundesliga and didn't win any trophies. And he comes with a lot of baggage and don't think he'd work well under the structure INEOS want to implement. Erik on the other hand worked well at Ajax under a structure where Overmars was dealing with recruitment and Van der Sar the CEO.
And this isn't judging Erik on just one game. He's reached 3 domestic cup finals in 2 years and won 2 of them. He finished 3rd last season with a points total only bettered by Jose of all the post-Fergie managers and it would have been higher if a lot of the players hadn't slacked off after the Carabao Cup win. So he can perform in the Premier League he just needs a settled team to do so and we've got very little strength in depth and Martinez and Shaw were badly missed, Mainoo was out for half the season, and no one was expecting Casemiro or Rashford's form to fall off a cliff. If we'd expected that we would have signed a more seasoned striker than Hojlund and prioritized defensive midfield instead of signing Mount and Amrabat and the season might have turned out very differently. He was also promised Greenwood would return. And he was probably hoping that Sancho would kick on this season.
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Post by mightyez on May 27, 2024 12:37:50 GMT
Not gonna lie, I do see what Stretty is saying, I think his fundamental point is that the man can't be judged on one game alone, but rather the whole season and in all fairness you probably chuck in last season too for balance. I also get the other side which is that Saturday was a reminder of the hope we all had when he was appointed, the way he has conducted at times has been admiral (but let's not forget the bizarre comments after some woeful games). The injuries have been mental and I think it's right up there with having the right structure in terms of priorities to getting things right on the pitch.
Personally my biggest question for ETH is why have you left it so late to make the right decisions? Amad on the right instead of Antony, a proper DM next to Mainoo (Casemiro has been terrible all season and Eriksen lost his legs last season).
The defence you can't fault him because the injuries have been mental.
I have no doubt in my mind that if we lost he would have been gone by now but the win means people are nervous.
Let's get it right there is plenty for INEOS to lose if ETH gets given more time and it's a disaster. it will impact players and the fans. If they get rid and the new person struggles they have plenty to lose their swell with players and the fans.
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Post by ratbag on May 27, 2024 12:40:37 GMT
Abso-fucking-lutely brilliant!!!
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Post by Jayrannasaurus on May 27, 2024 13:28:40 GMT
I totally get where Stretty is coming from too, and it's fine to disagree. I'm sure we agree on many more things than this outlook on ETH On Jose, we all agreed from the off: It will go south after 2 years, but at least we might win a trophy (we were desperate). That's exactly what happened, he had lost the dressing room and the fanbase. Weird revisionism. I actually like Jose!
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Post by mightyez on May 27, 2024 13:43:27 GMT
I totally get where Stretty is coming from too, and it's fine to disagree. I'm sure we agree on many more things than this outlook on ETH On Jose, we all agreed from the off: It will go south after 2 years, but at least we might win a trophy (we were desperate). That's exactly what happened, he had lost the dressing room and the fanbase. Weird revisionism. I actually like Jose! Bang on the money with Jose, just can't help himself when he gets frustrated
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Post by Stew on May 27, 2024 13:50:23 GMT
The Leicester guy is going to Chelsea.
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Post by harvindhillon on May 27, 2024 13:55:40 GMT
Just for the record as well, even before the final I was behind ETH, I didnt like how badly some of our games went and maybe on some game threads I posted that he probably is going but again that was just pure emotion from that game. I never said we needed to replace him. I still believe he will come good, he has shown he can win with bad teams, no surprise what he can do when he has his own team.
I said before as well I am not sure why everyone keeps going on and on about signings, Anthony was a 30m pound signing that only became 80m cause we had a shit backroom staff (Tough negotiating bullshit), sure he turned out shit but we dont know about Mount, he might come good or not but that's 2 out of how many players he has brought through the squad? Are you blaming Ole for the 80m gobshite Sancho? Again it was someone we didnt need nor add anything to the squad.
The amount of crap that ETH had to deal with off the pitch from the media leaks to the absolute circus he had to deal with Ronaldo, Greenwood, Anthony and Sancho. Then pile on the injuries. I will say it again, give these problems to any other manager let alone Southgate, we would be relegated!
Mourinho had similar issues with players but he threw everyone under the bus and lost the dressing room. ETH clearly hasnt, and clearly has instilled some discipline to the squad that Ole neglected just amplifying player power. Remember the reports about Pogba and Sancho showing up when they liked?
I think ETH will be true to his word, if he is sacked, he will win elsewhere, he has shown he is a serial winner. We were 3rd with a trophy last season and a final with a somewhat fit squad. Mourinho sure won 2 and the glorified friendly and came in 2nd the next year but we never challenged the cups and his last season we just fell apart everywhere, how is that even comparable?
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