Tom Cleverley

[Deleted]

Sept 8, 2013 3:36:55 GMT sleel6 said:

Sept 7, 2013 5:25:38 GMT @cavelly2k said:

If you have a good reason to back it up then fine but he's clearly being used as a scapegoat. How in fucking Zeus can you possibly single out Clevs against the scousers when the whole team was shit, nobody passed the ball backwards or lost it more than Giggs, but are people getting on his back?

Others are saying he's not good enough because he doesnt score enough.

So yes it's complete lunacy. He's been quoted as the next Scholes people say, Perhaps its the fact he's only 24 or that this is his 2nd season in the 1st team, give the lad a break, albeit suffering from injuries last season and being left out of the side I think he's done a good job.

Funny how Clevs, DDG, Rafael and Valencia have all seemed to have had way more shit than the players that have had ample time to prove their worth.

He's not a scapegoat at all. Everyone can see our midfield has been shite for years and everybody on this forum knows that Carrick is probably our most important and consistent player which is proof enough to suggest that the midfield problem may be stemming from the player he is being paired with not being good enough.

The way the OP worded it, he was using him as a scapegoat for the dipper game. When he was nowhere near our worst player. I'm a fan of the lad, I think some of the criticism he's had has been a bit over the top but I do acknowledge that he still has a way to go. He's improved a lot since coming on the scene all of 2 years ago. People need to realise he's only 24, he's only had 1 and a bit seasons in the first team, the same as Welbeck, there are area's to work on but you can see the determination to succeed and the will to get there. People's opinions will differ obviously, just think it's a bit harsh given some of the players we have in the squad and how they seem to get a pass for playing dogshite.

Clevs has been in the first team for 2 years and has considerably improved (hopefully will continue to do so)

Nani and Anderson have been in the first team for man years and have considerably failed to prove their worth as a first team regular, yet we focus on this lad.

I actually fear for Januzaj or Lingard or any other reserve player should they break it through to the first team.

[jimbonda]

Sept 8, 2013 12:40:03 GMT @cavelly2k said:

Clevs has been in the first team for 2 years and has considerably improved (hopefully will continue to do so)

has he? he looks the exact same cleverley who took to the field in the charity shield against city 2 years ago to me. passing is largely sideways or backwards. doesn't face the opposition goal enough, let alone attempt to take anyone on. first instinct is to turn home. doesn't create or score goals. can't shoot for toffee. negative. it's why hodgson loves him so much, other than a lack of options. he's a safe player to put in there because he can run all day, hassles, will rarely give the ball away. a workhorse player

[Deleted]

Sept 9, 2013 18:02:15 GMT jimbonda said:

Sept 8, 2013 12:40:03 GMT @cavelly2k said:

Clevs has been in the first team for 2 years and has considerably improved (hopefully will continue to do so)

has he? he looks the exact same cleverley who took to the field in the charity shield against city 2 years ago to me. passing is largely sideways or backwards. doesn't face the opposition goal enough, let alone attempt to take anyone on. first instinct is to turn home. doesn't create or score goals. can't shoot for toffee. negative. it's why hodgson loves him so much, other than a lack of options. he's a safe player to put in there because he can run all day, hassles, will rarely give the ball away. a workhorse player

Doesnt mean he's not good enough though.

[jimbonda]

true that paul. he's worth his place in the squad. you won't catch me ranting and ragging on him like people did with gibbo.
and the way the current squad shapes up I'd pick him most weeks myself. no-ones offering any sustained fight for his place.

[sharsh_U4L]

Sept 9, 2013 18:02:15 GMT jimbonda said:

Sept 8, 2013 12:40:03 GMT @cavelly2k said:

Clevs has been in the first team for 2 years and has considerably improved (hopefully will continue to do so)

has he? he looks the exact same cleverley who took to the field in the charity shield against city 2 years ago to me. passing is largely sideways or backwards. doesn't face the opposition goal enough, let alone attempt to take anyone on. first instinct is to turn home. doesn't create or score goals. can't shoot for toffee. negative. it's why hodgson loves him so much, other than a lack of options. he's a safe player to put in there because he can run all day, hassles, will rarely give the ball away. a workhorse player

Well described. 
IMO Cleverly is a player I would love to have in a SQUAD. Now with the arrival of Fellaini, his game time would be drastically reduced. Hope that spurs him & brings Out the Extra bit that he has locked in his cabinet.

[Bestie]

Sept 10, 2013 5:09:22 GMT sharsh_U4L said:

Sept 9, 2013 18:02:15 GMT jimbonda said:

has he? he looks the exact same cleverley who took to the field in the charity shield against city 2 years ago to me. passing is largely sideways or backwards. doesn't face the opposition goal enough, let alone attempt to take anyone on. first instinct is to turn home. doesn't create or score goals. can't shoot for toffee. negative. it's why hodgson loves him so much, other than a lack of options. he's a safe player to put in there because he can run all day, hassles, will rarely give the ball away. a workhorse player

Well described. 
IMO Cleverly is a player I would love to have in a SQUAD. Now with the arrival of Fellaini, his game time would be drastically reduced. Hope that spurs him & brings Out the Extra bit that he has locked in his cabinet.

Funny, Xavi does that and is considered one of the best player's in the world.

[henrik90]

Sept 10, 2013 8:51:36 GMT Bestie said:

Sept 10, 2013 5:09:22 GMT sharsh_U4L said:

has he? he looks the exact same cleverley who took to the field in the charity shield against city 2 years ago to me. passing is largely sideways or backwards. doesn't face the opposition goal enough, let alone attempt to take anyone on. first instinct is to turn home. doesn't create or score goals. can't shoot for toffee. negative. it's why hodgson loves him so much, other than a lack of options. he's a safe player to put in there because he can run all day, hassles, will rarely give the ball away. a workhorse player

Funny, Xavi does that and is considered one of the best player's in the world.

Agreed. In addition I have a friend who does that too and is in fact considered to be one of the best Estonian 3rd division footballers.

[jimbonda]

always preferred iniesta to xavi.

vast difference between xavi and cleverley. no need to elaborate really

[Deleted]

Sept 10, 2013 5:09:22 GMT sharsh_U4L said:

Sept 9, 2013 18:02:15 GMT jimbonda said:

has he? he looks the exact same cleverley who took to the field in the charity shield against city 2 years ago to me. passing is largely sideways or backwards. doesn't face the opposition goal enough, let alone attempt to take anyone on. first instinct is to turn home. doesn't create or score goals. can't shoot for toffee. negative. it's why hodgson loves him so much, other than a lack of options. he's a safe player to put in there because he can run all day, hassles, will rarely give the ball away. a workhorse player

Well described. 
IMO Cleverly is a player I would love to have in a SQUAD. Now with the arrival of Fellaini, his game time would be drastically reduced. Hope that spurs him & brings Out the Extra bit that he has locked in his cabinet.

Have to agree.

Clevs is a steady, solid workhorse. A good squad option.

This is by no means a bad thing, especially when the player in question has come through the ranks and not cost anything. United have always had players of that ilk, your Fletcher's, O'Shea's, P.Neville's. They were never real out and out first teamers. They'd come in and do a job when required. And when/if they left, you knew they weren't exactly likely to join a top 4 club and continue winning the big prize's. They'd drop down to mid table, which is their level if they want to be important first team players.

I like Cleverley and I'm happy he's at the club, but comparisons with likes of Scholes? Come on now.

[Stew]

Where has Clevs been compared to Scholes?

[Kojak]

Fletcher was absolutely a first team player a few years ago. I think it's unfair to put him in the bracket of "can do a job" after the way he flourished. Far more strings to his bow that Cleverley.

[Raf's Hairdryer Treatment]

Sept 7, 2013 14:27:04 GMT Bestie said:

As said before by myself and others, what Cleverley lacks isn't ability, it's initiative. He takes his cues from his midfield partners, rather than taking the initiative himself. I don't know if it's a tactical thing or an individual mentality but when Cleverley is paired with Carrick, he seems content to sit in the deeper position with him and just keep the ball moving. Makes himself available, passes the ball off, and holds.

With other partners, like Anderson or Kagawa, you see Cleverley being a lot more dynamic. He's always looking for the ball, getting into a square of space, but when he pops it off he's looking to get forwards and provide another option again.

He has the natural talent to pass-and-move quickly in his locker, we just need to see him use it more. Anytime you see him take the ball, it's always one, two touch-pass. Or touch-pass. If there is a chance to take it on a few yards, depending on who he's playing with he does it. Almost always in control of what he wants to do. That's a hallmark of good ability. We just need to see if we can get him adding 'the extra' on a consistent basis.

Definite signs of this for Ingerlund too. When he's given license, he's much more of a dynamic player.

Seems very much like a "does as he's told" type of player. Manager for says sit, so he sits. Manager says play wide or behind the front, he attacks.

[ericactor1]

Is Cleverly a good squad player? I'm not to sure.

As I mentioned in the 'Anderson' thread his performance at Anfield this season summed him up. To put it harshly he bottled it and he has been doing so for quite some time, when pressure comes knocking he hides, he doesn't want to be on the ball or near it. He'll run all game but will he really offer anything which is going to change the game? Carrick got stick off several United fans for years for not being effective, for passing the ball backwards and sideways the majority of the time. Cleverly is doing just that but we still seem to protect him, yes he is young and he has come through the youth system but lets not shy away from the fact that he has been a huge disappointment to us all since getting an opportunity in the first team. He hasn't kicked on to another level, its been two years now and he hasn't shown anything of a player who is going to be special. A player that is worthy of first team football at manchester United and at international level, it shocks me how he gets a game with England.

Cleverly could turn round to prove me wrong as I have said before but I just think he has been protected for too long by Manchester United fans, he has done nothing since arriving in the first team.

[Bestie]

At least those of us who back Tom CleverlEy know how to spell his damn name.

[Deleted]

Ze Furher has spoken!!